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  • #16
    Originally posted by Xpress View Post
    By saying this, you acknowledge you have a phone, you acknowledge they asked to see it, and you denied their request. When it is over, you have your phone and your bag. They have their insubordination charge.
    Notice I said I GUESS you could say. Didn't say I would neccesarily say that. There's a number of things you could say depending on where you wanted to go with it. As I said before there is a lot of gray area, can they search my bag, do I have to show them my phone etc. I've heard some people say yes and some say no. I'm just trying to find out our rights, their rights etc. I personally have no problem showing it to them because I keep mine off until we are stopped and not doing anything, which is perfectly legal so it doesn't matter if they get up on the engine and ask for it. On the other hand if you're in the middle of a switching move and they come up there, different story of course! In that case IF THEY ASK FOR YOUR PHONE DO YOU HAVE TO PULL IT OUT OF YOUR BAG AND SHOW IT TO THEM? I'm no Lawyer by any means but it just seems like there would have to be probable cause for them to make you get your phone out of your grip and show it to them. What are our rights on this?

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    • #17
      Also without doing research; if it is a company official (such as a TM) that instructs you to show your cellphone, then yes, you are obligated to show it under threat of insubordination. You have the right to decline just as you have the right to work some place else, however, they must toe the line so that it is not construed as harassment against you. If it is the RR police or an FRA guy then, no, as then you have the constitutional protections available to you such as unreasonable search and seizure since they are government representatives.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by TinLizard View Post
        Also without doing research; if it is a company official (such as a TM) that instructs you to show your cellphone, then yes, you are obligated to show it under threat of insubordination. You have the right to decline just as you have the right to work some place else, however, they must toe the line so that it is not construed as harassment against you. If it is the RR police or an FRA guy then, no, as then you have the constitutional protections available to you such as unreasonable search and seizure since they are government representatives.
        Thanks. Best answer yet. I agree they would have to toe the line on the harassment deal though. Especially if it got to be an every week occurence.

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        • #19
          I may start keeping my old cell phone in my grip which is deader than a doornail since it hasn't been used in over a year. Why yes Mr Official, I'd be glad to show you my cell. Damn I forgot to charge it up before coming to work
          WTF Over??

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Snake View Post
            I may start keeping my old cell phone in my grip which is deader than a doornail since it hasn't been used in over a year. Why yes Mr Official, I'd be glad to show you my cell. Damn I forgot to charge it up before coming to work
            That is just crazy enough it might work.

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            • #21
              I keep an old one in my bag for that reason. Never been asked to show it, but just in case.

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              • #22
                I just say I don't carry at work......that gets a screwball look from them, but they inquire no further.
                sigpic ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ "Come and get them" Leonidas I to Xerxes, at Battle of Thermopylae

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                • #23
                  True BNSF story; some dimwit Southwest Division DS answered her cell phone while the chief was watching! She was quickly removed from her chair and taken to the back of the NOC where, I assume, bad things happened. I, a probie DS training a few pods over, was asked to cover her desk until her relief arrived though I had never before seen it and, thusly, knew nothing about it. We had been told during class to turn our phones off and stowed when we entered the NOC, but this girl apparently didn't care. I know this doesn't answer the OP's question, but this thread reminded me of that long-forgotten tale. Sorry for flipping that derail!

                  TXCOMT
                  Last edited by txcomt; 05-06-2016, 01:57 AM.

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                  • #24
                    I reckon if you smoke crack in front of a cop, you ought not be surprised if he objects. Likewise....we know what we are supposed to be doing. Doing it on the sly is going to happen...but doing it in the bright sunshine is so strange that it begs for interception.
                    sigpic ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ "Come and get them" Leonidas I to Xerxes, at Battle of Thermopylae

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                    • #25
                      Arbitration cases are the controlling history, and arbitrators are taking a dimmer view on anything relating to phone violations. We (NS) recently had an engineer permafired for not showing his phone to the trainmaster who "thought" he saw him using the phone.

                      If you say you don't have a phone, you had better be damn sure the other person in the cab hasn't seen you with one. If it's his job vs yours, they just got a star witness that puts a phone in your hand. Believe it.

                      The easiest thing is to make sure you are in compliance, show them whatever they want to see, and carry on about making a paycheck. Anything else is rolling the dice.

                      Rico
                      Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Rico Suave View Post
                        Arbitration cases are the controlling history, and arbitrators are taking a dimmer view on anything relating to phone violations. We (NS) recently had an engineer permafired for not showing his phone to the trainmaster who "thought" he saw him using the phone.

                        If you say you don't have a phone, you had better be damn sure the other person in the cab hasn't seen you with one. If it's his job vs yours, they just got a star witness that puts a phone in your hand. Believe it.

                        The easiest thing is to make sure you are in compliance, show them whatever they want to see, and carry on about making a paycheck. Anything else is rolling the dice.

                        Rico
                        I agree

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by JohnEasley View Post

                          I think we're opening up something that usually isn't even discussed. They have rules written about drugs and firearms on the property however I would suspect they would have to see it in plain sight as no one in their right mind would allow a search by anyone, Police included. If there is no probable cause for search, and that includes by the railroad, then there is no way someone needs to subject themselves to one. If one was removed from service because of it, they better have a pretty strong case on why they required one.

                          In my time here and as many people as I know throughout the system, I have never heard of an actual search of anyones bags or person.
                          I knew a guy in Oakland California that beat a case and got reinstated for the Carrier finding OZ of pot in his bag he didn't place in there himself. It was a Set UP and he got fired and beat the case ...hands down. UTU power back then

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by papaboy60 View Post

                            Notice I said I GUESS you could say. Didn't say I would neccesarily say that. There's a number of things you could say depending on where you wanted to go with it. As I said before there is a lot of gray area, can they search my bag, do I have to show them my phone etc. I've heard some people say yes and some say no. I'm just trying to find out our rights, their rights etc. I personally have no problem showing it to them because I keep mine off until we are stopped and not doing anything, which is perfectly legal so it doesn't matter if they get up on the engine and ask for it. On the other hand if you're in the middle of a switching move and they come up there, different story of course! In that case IF THEY ASK FOR YOUR PHONE DO YOU HAVE TO PULL IT OUT OF YOUR BAG AND SHOW IT TO THEM? I'm no Lawyer by any means but it just seems like there would have to be probable cause for them to make you get your phone out of your grip and show it to them. What are our rights on this?
                            I keep mine stowed and tell them I don't have one with me. I leave it at home. Never really needed at work. Radios and PBX' channels. " Hey babe, I am on the way home and on the train, What for dinner? LOL They other employees and fans listening with scanners have a laugh.

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